John Mino:
Good morning, I'm John Mino and along with my colleague, Christine Hesse in Washington DC, we're honored to be joined today by Congressman Dave Joyce representing Ohio's 14th congressional district. Ohio's 14th congressional district is comprised of the Eastern and the Southeastern suburbs of greater Cleveland. And as a result, Dave is my Congressman. I've known Dave for almost 30 years, going back to his days as Geauga County prosecutor. And throughout that time, Dave and I have been on a lot of rooms together. We've been in Central Committee meetings, we've been in Horseman Committee meetings, we've been at Lincoln Day Dinners. We've been in some outdoor rooms too Dave, and it's always been fun. And in all of those rooms, you've always commanded a wide degree of respect and support across the spectrum.
John Mino:
I've been honored also to work with Dave in all of his Congressional Campaigns, starting with his Congressional Campaign in 2012, and the primary process associated with that campaign. As a matter of fact, Dave, I have a momento, the Dave Joyce hand sanitizer from the 2016 campaign. Given the events of the last several months, it's come in quite handy and been well-received as I continue to hand it out in support of your ongoing campaigns.
John Mino:
In the Congress, Dave serves on the Committee on Appropriations, and he's the ranking member on the Subcommittee on Interior and Environment. He enjoys a broad degree of respect for his bipartisanship. He's worked very effectively on the Appropriations Committee with fellow Northeastern Ohio Congressional members, Marcy Kaptur and Tim Ryan. As a matter of fact, Dave was most recently acknowledged for his bipartisanship by the US Chamber of Commerce and awarding him its first ever Jefferson-Hamilton Award for Bipartisanship. Dave even in Congress also serves on the Problem Solvers Caucus, the Great Lakes Task Force, the Task Force to End Sexual Violence, the Congressional Nursing Caucus and the Buy American Caucus. And I'm going to have a question for you later on the Buy American Caucus.
John Mino:
Our format today is very simple. We're going to cover a wide range of topics, including what's going on in DC and the report for the Appropriations Committee. Dave is going to give us some opening remarks. I'm going to turn the questioning over to Christine to handle, and we're going to conclude 11:30 or soon as we can. Congressman Joyce, welcome.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
Thank you very much, John. Yeah, I was ahead of my time with those...
Christine Hesse:
Sanitizer.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
I wish I had 5,000 of those now instead in '18 when I only had one. Thank you both Christine and John for hosting this. And I want to thank everybody for the kind introduction and for being here today. There's certain developments in Congress this year that we want to highlight, so I'll do my best to address them through the questions [inaudible 00:00:03:00]. Thank you again for having me this morning.
Christine Hesse:
Great. Well thank you Congressman Joyce. And we look forward to having the conversation with you, and I'll just add well, I don't live in Northern Virginia any longer in the congressional districts. I've known you for decades as well, and you are the Congressman for my mom and dad. And since I have not been able to see my father since about the beginning of the year, perhaps you can drive by and give him a wave and say hello for me as well. If we could-
Congressman Dave Joyce:
I'd be glad to. I miss the pancake breakfast he hosts every year so...
Christine Hesse:
Yeah, exactly. So I'd like to start the conversation with the biggest topic obviously that has consumed the country over the last number of months, COVID-19, and the business closures and closing of the economy as a result. And one of the most important issues in front of the Congress in terms of dealing with this pandemic has been trying to provide economic relief, with a number of measures that have passed since almost the outbreak in early March. The signature program for small business in these relief bails, has been the Paycheck Protection Program or PPP, which provides direct incentives for small businesses to keep their workers on the payroll.
Christine Hesse:
On June 5th, President Trump signed the Paycheck Protection Program Flexibility Act, which was passed by Congress days earlier, and it made significant changes to address a number of issues. As the PPP was rolled out, the 1st iteration, the 2nd iteration, I know you probably heard from a number of small businesses around your district, and around the country that were looking for more flexibility. And so wanted to see if you could spend a couple of minutes just talking about some of those changes that were signed in that Flexibility Act.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
That's a great question. Thank you, Christine. I was proud to serve as one of the original co-sponsors of the Paycheck Protection Program. The legislation initially had allowed for forgiveness of expense for the original eight week covered period, we had to change that. Under the new rules, expenses from 24 weeks from the date the loan is originated, can now be forgiven. Additionally, keep in mind the generous unemployment benefits created challenges for businesses looking to rehire their workers. I'm continuing to hear this now as businesses are coming back online. So this legislations allows employers, which make a good-faith effort to rehire workers but ultimately they're not successful, to remain eligible for PPP forgiveness.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
It changes that the current rule required 75% of the PPP loan to be used on payroll costs and 25% to be used on mortgage interest, rent, utilities, the ruler, now we've changed it to 60% to be used on payroll and 40% to be used on mortgage, rent and utilities. There may be even more flexibility as time goes on.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
And the good thing to know is that there's still money in those programs. So those of you who may have not have gotten in, some larger corporations gave money back because they found the rules to be too oppressive or they found loans from somewhere else, so there's money back in there that is able to be circulated. You'll hear folks talking about the fact that, mostly the Republicans say, "That's why we didn't vote for the HEROES Act because not like this. This money has not gotten into circulation yet." There's money that has been appropriated through the COVID relief one, two, three, and that's still waiting to get out of the system. So once that's out there and it has a chance to percolate, and more states have the ability to come back online, I'm sure we're going to address this going forward.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
But it clarifies that small businesses are also receiving assistance, can deduct expenses paid from PPP loan from their taxes. And that is a question I got right away from a businessman out in Lake County, he's pretty astute. And myself having been an accounting major and studied tax and law school, I was like, "Wow, I didn't think about that." And I brought it up with the Secretary Mnuchin when we were out of our conference calls and he said, "Yeah." Then all of a sudden other members started to jump on it. And so we managed to fix that too, so it's also deductible. And the changes are a direct result that all of us receive, whose businesses that are struggling to meet the initial requirements and allows the businesses to leverage the full amount of their loan while maintaining the eligibility for forgiveness.
Christine Hesse:
Great. I'm sure the feedback has been positive since then, too from businesses.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
Yes.
Christine Hesse:
Great. So speaking of Secretary Mnuchin, both Federal Reserve Chairman Powell and Treasury Secretary Mnuchin have both recently publicly indicated that more federal support is needed for struggling businesses. Chairman Powell in his semi-annual report to Congress on monetary policy, a couple of weeks ago, testified that a wide variety of data reveal an alarming picture of small business health during the COVID-19 crisis. Similarly, Secretary Mnuchin also testified that he backed putting more money into the economy, targeted to helping specific businesses reopen. I'm curious if there is likely to be another PPP loan program passed by Congress, and what you think it might look like, and the potential timing for another PPP package.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
It's funny, I was working out at Sunday morning in one of the shows Larry Kudlow was on. And he said that he thought there'd be another package for around $2 trillion, and then you fell off the treadmill. Again, it's a great question. But right now, as I said before, there's $150 billion still left in the PPP program. And certainly Secretary Mnuchin has demonstrated an interest in reopening up some of the remaining funding for businesses which have been uniquely harmed by the pandemic. And those are a lot of folks I heard from here such as restaurants, salons, places that were closed and mandated to be closed, and especially your high-end restaurants that weren't really set up for carry out. They got rid of all their supplies, they got rid of all the inventory, the people couldn't come back. They couldn't find work. So I think it was important that for those, they be allowed to apply for a second round of PPP dollars as they start back in and they have to operate at 50% of capacity versus the 100% that they were at before. Discussions on this topic and with the Treasury, have the authority to make that call or whether it requires an Act of Congress to fix some of these things. And I'm hopeful as the economy starts and the states begin to reopen, we need to be realistic. Effects of this pandemic will last for some time. So with that in mind, I do think Congress will continue to evaluate programs to assist industries that remain uniquely impacted, or who have received assistance and have been starting to see the unintended consequences of real issues during this.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
When I was brought up in... I got to get a shout out to Secretary Mnuchin who had 200 plus service members on these conference calls, firing questions at him and he'd handle them off boom, boom, boom off the top of his head. And he knew what he was... He knew the whole programs. And he'd be, if I can fix that, like I had brought up on main street lending with them and the not allowed for companies to deduct or to take any type of dividends during the course of, well, some of that's, as we all know, it's written into their operating instructions. So they were, they're supposed to get the dividends to pay their taxes, but wouldn't want that. And you know, "Yeah, that's great idea. Send that to me." When I brought up the extending the PPP and the problem we're having with restaurants and salons, "That's a statutory one. You guys have to fix that." So as in, the rural hospitals were another one where there was a lot of problems with, when you cut down the elective surgery, you cut off their lifeblood. I mean, so it's going to take a while to do that.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
So with that in mind, we continue to look at the programs that we've already put in place. Maybe find the other programs to help those uniquely impacted. And the PPP was an innovative response, but with all new programs, there's some hard lessons learned and so we need to increase the focus on the need for flexibility, but also for transparency. And what I could tell you with a 100% certainty, that I will continue to do everything in my power to reignite our economy, equip our businesses with the tools they need to weather the storm, so we can quickly go back to being an integral part of the Buckeye Economy.
Christine Hesse:
Wonderful. I want you to pivot to healthcare, you mentioned it already. That's obviously been a big part of the COVID 19 response and the CARES Act relief package, which was the third COVID 19 bill that was passed, and you voted for as well. And we appreciate your support. Provided over $100 billion for hospitals and health systems. The funding was used to help with medical professionals get the supplies they desperately needed like gloves, additional beds, face masks and gowns, as well as respirators and ventilators. What other health related initiatives are you currently working on, in addition to the COVID-19 response initiatives?
Congressman Dave Joyce:
I'm glad you brought that up. Back in March, I wrote a bipartisan letter signed by over 40 of my colleagues to vote to fight for the $100 billion for the Provider Relief Fund, because it proved critical funding for hospitals, and other healthcare providers, who've taken a huge financial hit from having to postpone those elective procedures I brought up before. This pandemic has forced all of us, medical providers, elected representatives of patients alike to rethink a lot of our healthcare system.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
One of those examples is Telehealth. It's certainly not new concept, but it's much more widespread these days, especially important for vulnerable populations, such as our seniors. And even though we're coming out of this and there's the ability to do elective surgeries, seniors who comprise a fair amount of the procedures that take place are, in nursing homes. And so, having to leave to go to a hospital or the doctor's office, return, are quarantined from their friends for 14 days because they've been outside the facility, that creates an issue for them. And people then put it off because they don't want to miss the access to their friends. And there's social (silence) HHS, Telehealth Resource Center program to support nursing home facilities and expanding their use of Telehealth services. The bill would also establish a new grant program within HHS, to allow nursing home residents to participate in virtual visits with family and friends during the period when social distancing guide prohibits any in-person visits. That social isolation, the distancing measures they've put our seniors and it's heartbreaking. And I'm hopeful that with initiatives like this one, we can improve the ability for families, doctors, and seniors to connect with each other safely.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
I mean, history will judge whether the decisions we made in March are correct, but as we look forward, God forbid there is a second bump because financially, I don't know if the country could afford it, but secondly, we'd be much better suited to lock down the nursing home communities, disband work at the universities and send those kids home, and prisons are what they are, there's not a hell lot we can do about that.
Christine Hesse:
You mentioned obviously the spending and spending fatigue on the Hill. And I know the US House, it's been very busy. The majority passed the HEROES Act, which we talked about in mid-May and it sits at the Senate desk. And as you mentioned, I think a lot of members are interested in seeing more data and actually seeing all the money be in the system, before we continue to authorize and appropriate additional dollars at that level. But I know that the House is expected to bring up a massive infrastructure bill here, right towards the end of the month in early July. And I was interested in what your thoughts are about that legislation, if you could share those with us.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
A running joke on the Hill is, it's always infrastructure. In my seven and a half years there, I can tell you that there's been no package that has more bipartisan support, and less get done than infrastructure. And it's sort of sad. We need something and we need something that's, Initially what I've told folks here at home and reaching out to elected officials, state, county, and local officials, a lot of those projects that they were going to put on went on hold when this all came on. So communities are not paving roads or doing something. And everybody thinks maybe infrastructure is building roads too, but we have to have some bipartisan support in pushing something that includes, and I understand from my friends and the majority, that they want to bring other things in like water infrastructure. I get that.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
But one of the things we have to make sure of, is that we also take care of the broadband. And I always pushed it off before saying we shouldn't involve them. That's a private system and let Charter Spectrum and the rest of them fight it out, but, I really saw, unfortunately firsthand, we don't have, along our Pennsylvania border has to Trumbull the connectivity. And so therefore we're having to put in hotwire, I forgot what they call them, hot boxes or WiFi, basically in a band and put it out in community centers, so kids could come and get their homework done and download their homework and get those things. And that's why you would see McDonald's, even though it was a drive through, you'd see the parking lot full because people were there using the WiFi.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
But for a major package to be signed in law, it has to have true bi-partisan support and I haven't unfortunately seen that yet to the degree. I think it's necessary that we can push it across the finish line. The HEROES Act, I'm in the group of Problem Solvers, there's equal number of Democrats or Republicans and we try to work on big picture things like that. And I could tell you with the HEROES Act, the day before it was going to be announced, not one of them had... Not a single Democrat in our group had seen that bill. So it was all put together in Nancy Pelosi's offices, which isn't a way to start the program. Up to the first couple in COVID relief, we all worked together on. And granted there's things she liked, there's things she didn't like, but hey, we need to move the country forward, and we did. I'm hopeful that we can get together in a good-faith bipartisan talks about infrastructure, and move on a package because our country certainly needs it.
Christine Hesse:
As John mentioned in his introduction, you're an important member of the very powerful House Appropriations Committee, and I know from working on appropriations that March through July is typically a very busy time on Capitol Hill with the House and Senate producing appropriation bills to fund the federal government. COVID-19 is obviously delayed action on the several, 12 I think, appropriations packages, the different bills for fiscal 2021. And I wanted to see if you could share with us kind of where that is in the process, and the prospects of getting the federal government funded for the next year.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
That's another great question because it highlights what we've normally done over months, we're going to try to do in two weeks here at the beginning of July. And we're going to have our markups on 12 different committees, and some will be almost three a day. And they plan on voting on all 12 of the bills by the end of July. And so the Appropriations Committee, we're going to be back those first two weeks, processing these bills in putting them together. Now in the past, members could go on the floor, and we'd have what they call a vote and roll where they can make amendments, and they voted up or down on each amendment. To give you an idea, the Interior bill there's 80 plus. When you imagine what it's like when you get to Defense or Labor and Health and Human Services, there's hundreds of amendments that people put in. This year that's not going to be possible because under the new stricter voting procedures, it takes 60, 70 minutes each vote, and you can't just sit on the floor and knock out 20 of these at a time, like we did in the past.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
So therefore, if you have any concerns out there, that you would normally get impressed in either language or report language or something in the bills of the appropriations, it's important that you get that known to myself or other members now, while we can get it done, while we still have a chance to do those things. Because given the compacted nature of the process this year, I encourage everybody to weigh in, and let us know what it is while the bills are in Committee with their proposed amendments, because the amendments that we make at committee are going to be the ones contained in the final bill, which will be closed out on the floor.
Christine Hesse:
Well thank you for the offer. And that's good to hear that there's still time available to work with you, and your office to try to make sure that those measures are taken care of. Keeping in line with spending, as you know, there are discretionary spending caps that were passed last year and so there are flat funding levels, yet we are seeing sharp increases needed for veterans health care programs. I know you've been a huge advocate of veterans. In fact, earlier this year, you introduced the VA Quality Health Care, Accountability, and Transparency Act. Can you share more about your bill, and other issues you're working on, on behalf of veterans?
Congressman Dave Joyce:
I'm going to be honored to. My father was a World War II veteran who was shot and left for dead. And he'd get that check in the first of the month, and he'd always shake it and say, "Yeah, today we get some good bourbon." That was highlight of it. And he would talk about the need for making sure that we take care of those folks who are willing to make the ultimate sacrifice on behalf of our country. But the bill was crafted in response to a GAO report that found the VA was failing to disclose waiting times, patient safety and quality of care information, and ensuring that veterans were getting it in an accessible and usable manner. Another important thing was ensuring our veterans receive the highest quality mental health care. The unfortunate fact is that while the VA War Department was combating veterans suicide, making it their top priority, still at least 20 veterans per day die in this country. That is 20 too many.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
I'm committed and working with my colleagues to address this. And recently I've also sponsored H.R 3495, the Improve Well-Being for Veterans Act. The bill would authorize a grant program that allows VA to provide funding to non-profits and community organizations, including state and local organizations, that coordinate the delivery of services to veterans at the risk of suicide. The bill has 253 co-sponsors, so hopefully leadership will quickly bring this to the floor.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
We've also seen great success in treating severe PTSD with service dogs, God bless. That's why I'm proud to be an original co-sponsor of 43O5, the PAWS for Veterans Therapy Act, the bill passed the house in February with direct for VA to carry out a pilot program on dog training therapy. Another thing I always got from my father said that if you want somebody who's always happy to see you when you come home, get a dog, and truer words were never spoken.
Christine Hesse:
Yeah, I think everyone has seen across the country, right? The shelters. They can't even keep the puppies anymore. There's so many people that have been adopting. So certainly it speaks well to mental health in terms of having a four legged friend with you. If I could turn back to appropriation, you're the highest ranking Republican on the House Appropriations Subcommittee on Interior and Environment. So you are extremely well positioned to help with the Great Lakes, which I know continues to be a high priority for you. Please talk about your efforts with prioritizing the preservation and protection of the Great Lakes, including the Great Lakes Restoration initiative.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
I'd be glad to. I was sort of honored when a member came up to me one day and started asking me questions and he said, "Look, I understand you're the Great Lakes guy." And I said, "Well, thanks." We try to make sure... One thing that Steve had passed down to me when I took over, he said, "Find something that you can get involved in, and make a difference." Because everybody here is... You notice people have bill [inaudible 00:24:38], they try to be on top of everything. So I found that the Great Lakes were something that I really care about because, it's an invaluable natural resource and an economic powerhouse. It remains the utmost importance to preserve and protect them, not only for ourselves, but for future generations of Americans. And having grown up here, having worked on the... My father's company was down on the Cuyahoga River loading boats out, having fished and swam in the river. And, having some failed romantic walks on the beach up there at... And, mentored during my high school days, I'm really impressed by the Great Lakes.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
One thing that really got to me was, when folks came here for the convention in '16, and they were looking out at Great Lakes and nobody knows about it. And they're like, "Wow, this is fantastic." So, my parents had taught me the importance of protecting the lakes, and I'm honored to do this. And as you mentioned, I'm the Ranking member on the Committee Interior, and the other three people are from the West where a lot of the activity for Interior takes place with Bureau of Land Management and other things. So they keep telling me, "Look, you're not a one trick pony here for the Great Lakes. You got to remember all of us." And so it's been a learning experience for me.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
But the most important thing is being asked to be the Co-Chair of the House Great lakes Task Force. In December Congress passed and President signed to law, the 2020 Interior EPA spending bill, which included a $20 million increase taking the $320 million, the Great Lakes Restoration Initiative, and increases the resources to prevent Asian carps from getting into the Lakes. Now I'll continue working with my friend chair McCullum, a fellow member from the Great Lakes region on a number of great lakes priorities, as we craft the fiscal 2021 spending bill, including prioritizing funding for the GLRI, addressing harmful algal blooms, the high water levels, unfortunately the ongoing efforts to keep the invasive carp out of Great Lakes because should they get in, their appetite is so voracious it'll be game, set, match for sport fishing that we now appreciate so much. And you know, let's face it protecting the Great Lakes is not a red issue or a blue issue. It's truly something that many members from both sides of the aisle understand. I'm honored to be working with them and discussing the important roles it plays in our lives, in our economy, and for the future generations.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
And so, I was proud to introduce the Great Lakes Restoration Initiative Act of 2019. It would reauthorize the GRI for five years more because a lot of these projects that we depend on, can't stop and start. They need to know they have level of funding over a period of time in order to fix the erosion, in order to fix the river beds and make sure that we protect them. And so we increased the $300 million it was at, to $475 million annually by the year 2026. And it passed the house by 373 to 45, so I've got all 45 names laminated, and I'm going to work on them too, as we move along here. But I remain hopeful. My colleagues in the Senate will move this to the President's desk and while much work needs to be done on the Great Lakes, we're making some great strides in it and support is instrumental. And I want to thank everyone here for, especially both of you, for the things that you've done in advocating with your clients, for the Great Lakes.
Christine Hesse:
Well, we thank you for your leadership on that area. And I have wonderful memories of splashing around off the shores of Lake Erie. So thank you for the conversation today, and I will turn you over to my colleague John.
John Mino:
I was going to ask you the last question on Buy American caucus. Why don't you give us an update on what's coming there? I mean, I know there's been a lot of talk in the last few days about, well, a few months really about re-shoring on-shoring. I know you've always been a big supporter of Ohio manufacturing, so why don't you wrap up with a little report on Buy American caucus, and where you see things come down the pipe there, Dave, and then we'll wrap it up.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
I appreciate it, John. You know, I've always said that China was not our friend or an ally. I know, and as you well know, from representing too many businesses that are doing business over there and had their IP stolen.
John Mino:
Yep.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
You know, in this pandemic, it's taught us a lot of things, but one of the foremost being that we cannot continue to rely on Asians, who don't have our best interests in mind. And so, especially when it comes to essential goods. This is particularly critical when it is, as we noticed, when it came to healthcare supplies and pharmaceuticals. We import almost all of our over the counter pain medications from China, including 95% of ibuprofen. Additionally, 90% of the prescription medications, that Americans take are made in China, including antidepressants and chemotherapy treatments, as well as medication for Alzheimer's, diabetes and epilepsy, that it's not to mention that 97% of all our antibiotics come from China. As a caucus, we're interested in furthering policies that incentivize manufacturers, to bring those operations back to the US. This is no longer just a matter of job creation, this is paramount to our national security and it's something I really look forward to working with, incentivizing, bringing this work home and letting Americans do what they do best. Excel in manufacturing.
John Mino:
Well, we'll be here to work with you on that Dave and echoing Christine's comments, we really appreciate your being with us today. Maybe we'll do this again. I'll look forward to seeing you back in the district or in DC, and, wish you the best of luck, and say hello to Kelly and the family for us. And we'll be in touch.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
You're very kind. Thank you very much. Thank you, John and Christine for organizing the discussion, and I hope it's provided you with some helpful insight. As we discussed in the PPP Flexibility Ac, direct input from stakeholders is truly invaluable to members when crafting this type of legislation, so I encourage all of you to stay in touch. As a member of my staff, Amanda Kane is also on this call. Please do not hesitate to reach out to her directly as well, joyce.house.gov, go to our website, put in the information, any requests and the things you're having issues with.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
Glad to help out here. Because I look at this as I may be in the 14th district, but I represent Northeast Ohio. I really want to make sure business comes back here. I want to make sure it's a place for our kids and our grandkids to grow up. We've come a long way, even though we have a Lake that's eerie and a tower that's terminal.
Christine Hesse:
That's a good one.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
If there are any questions that anybody has out there that didn't get asked today, please feel free to follow up with again, joyce.house.gov. Thank you all for being here today, and thank you for all what you do for Northeastern Ohio.
John Mino:
Thanks Dave.
Congressman Dave Joyce:
Take care.
John Mino:
Yep.
Christine Hesse:
Bye-bye.